I still say you part it out
 

I still say you part it out and make like 500% profit, but that's just because I've had some good luck with Ebay lately.

Re: might be the weight of the
 

Shame indeed! All of those wasted ponies festering under your hood! Whats next? You gonna buy a Hummer? :-)

oh, to live in
 

oh, to live in pennsylvania.

there's a 1980 comutacar on ebay with 88 original miles. needs partial restoration and batteries, but still...

ebay link

https://i14.ebayimg.com/05/i/06/73/a4/17_0.JPG

--

on an unrelated note, i got the alarm working in the swift. now nobody will steal it. hilarious.

yup
 

Hey I was looking at my Geo today with a guy that may be welding it for me - the left side looked pretty rusty too. Damn thing started right up after a couple of weeks of sitting. Looks like that wheel is back too far just like mine is right now.

How much was the delivery
 

How much was the delivery charge again? That thing looks pretty badass, you should put a manequin in it and scare people driving by at night.

Re: delivery was $125. we
 

I'd also check ebay. YOu might be able to sell a few of the knick-knacks on that thing.

I'm jealous :(

16,000
 

Kind of makes you think about the fork lift driving into a bunch of boxes in a movie - more likely it continues through the boxes and through the wall and the wall after that too! Imagine driving that thing on the road and hitting something - BAM! Hey keep the lift and use it to raise cars to work under them!! Easy way to do a belly pan!

you know, looking at that
 

you know, looking at that thing has me thinking similar thoughts. except more like: man, how flimsy our little cars are!

definitely easy to do a belly pan with this. i wish we could somehow use it to lift *itself* up so get at the motors. they have to come out from underneath. the technician says that's how they take them out at work - use another truck to lift up the back end and then block it. my buddy is tracking down some heavy duty jacks tomorrow. i'm going to start tracing wires to figure out how it's put together.

lift
 

ramps - drive it up some ramps on a stack of boards or bricks - if you have down force on the forks then press down on a stack of bricks/blocks to lift the body up.

CT eh? You think it'll get
 

CT eh? You think it'll get picked up quickly?

Re: irony of the week: took
 

I'd find a way to get it if I were you. YOu can still break even on the forklift, and even make a profit on the other metro.

But then there is the issue of getting it from CT. how far is it from you?

Then again, taking a free one would definately not help with the "learning" issue. Maybe you can get someone to pull all of the parts and ship them to you.

ct is probably 10-12 hrs
 

ct is probably 10-12 hrs away from here.

but the free metro ev was claimed within an hour of that post going up.

we will stay the course! onwards to frankenswift! suzukistein!

Motor weight
 

The Scion 1500cc motor dressed is 187 lbs all aluminum and plastic.

The Geo stock motor is probably in the 150 lbs range I would guess - it is really small. The major weight in a motor is the crank.

My engine with tranny with
 

My engine with tranny with fluids would weigh about 180 I'd say. I can pick it up by myself but of course I hurt myself in the process. I did it the other day, :p

Yeah
 

Yeah - but maybe you end up with a very efficient motor . . . then again I have a 8 HP electric brushless that weighs 15 lbs. and the 16 HP version only weighs about 22 lbs. with efficiency over 92%

jangeo, does size of a
 

jangeo, does size of a brushed motor relate directly to efficiency?

i understand that motor heat is a symptom of inefficiency, and a large motor like this is much less succeptible to overheating.

but is its low heating a result of some inherently more efficient design, or because it's just a better heat sink?

motors
 

Usually the bigger the motor the more core material there is which supports the magnetic fields needed. The real indicator of efficency is the amount of copper in the motor - the heavier the wire the more efficient it will be. The extra mass helps with cooling but the real indicator is how much air flow it needs - if completely sealed then it is better - the more air slots the poorer the design as it will tend to get hot and needs a lot of cooling if run at high power levels. There is also peak load as in lifting in a fork lift and moving plus it is not getting any high speed air moving under the hood and it may be inside in a hot warehouse. So I don't think you will have cooling issues - you can probably push the power way up in this motor too for short durations. Hopefully the brushes are ok too!

Re: another couple of hours
 

I just had a recurring idea. I grew up around locomotives with my father being an engineer. Long story short, I got to know how they worked from the time I was like 3 years old.

For those who don't know, it's an interesting process, which has worked well for over 50 years. The "Prime Mover" is the big Diesel engine that you hear rumbling. This engine ranges in number of cylinders 12-16, and the pistons are larger than you or I. Redline is around 500 RPM.

The Diesel engine turns a huge generator, which produces a schload of electricity. The electric power from the generator goes to the "Traction Motors", which is what moves the locomotive (some have 4, some 6). When slowing or going down a large hill, instead of burning up the brakes or losing air, many loco models have what's called "Dynamic Braking". The traction motor's polarity is reversed, and turned into generators. The resistance slows the train and sends the electricity to huge capacitors where the juice is lost in heat dissipation.

I've thought many times how this would work to power a car. Could a small engine and generator, in team with some batteries, use the same concept to make a car that's FE? The purpose of the batteries could be used to get the vehicle going, then the engine kicks in to get the power flowing to recharge the batteries and power the traction motor on the vehicle. In addition, regenerative/dynamic braking could charge the batteries. The question would be whether the generator and small engine would weigh more than the additional batteries on an electric-only setup. The range would definitely increase, as would the speed (depending on your electric motor). A plug-in system could re-charge the batts overnight. Almost like a hybrid, but perhaps more efficient.

Sorry to beat on GM again, but half locomotives out there are made by a division of GM, and the other half by GE. GM has the technology -- modify it into cars!

RH77

If you want to guess it's
 

If you want to guess it's weight, do this:

While holding it, stand on a scale. Then stand on the scale without it and subtract the difference.

What? You can't hold 400lbs? Pansy!

https://danacarveylvr.1colony.com/images/hansnfranz.jpg

<--goofy mood.

Quote:The "Prime Mover" is
 

Nice aristotle joke there, bud.

Re: Quote:The "Prime Mover" is
 

Well smarty pants, that's actually what the industry calls it. So, did you get anything else out of the post???

RH77

Quote:So, did you get
 

I did sir, I was just to busy with my ****ed up car and my mountains of homework to say something intelligent about it.

Re: Quote:So, did you get
 

I'm just bustin' your chops. I'm actually trying to multitask with work reports and this darn addictive site as well :-) No need for Sir, I haven't been Knighted by the Queen of England yet. But thanks anyways. Just call me...

RH77

I think sir is a very
 

I think sir is a very gallant name, and I will use it for all eternity. I wonder when I'll get my homework done...

Re: I think sir is a very
 

Well then, Sir, I agree, and I thank you for your gallantry (if that's even a word. If it isn't, it is now). I'm getting nothing done either. ;-) I mean, you work all day, or you take classes all day, in the evening, sometimes you just want to indulge in a hobby like gassavers and the History channel. I'm stuck at a Hotel as usual, so my options are limited. Like I'm going to work out at the fitness center -- I won't have connectivity! I could take the Aveo LS for a spin in Little Rock, Arkansas (yay). Finally I got a bargain-basement rental complete with crank windows and manual locks. New cars are just getting too big. This "small car" seems big enough to me. But more on that when I get the time to write my review on it. I still have a few in the queue to enter...

RH77

hybrid
 

FORGETABOUTIT - the losses in a car would cost you too much mpg - a loco needs it to do it that way because it can not make gears and a clutch big enough to move that kind of load with direct drive. They spend a lot of $$ on making the motors cheeper and more efficient and have the space to play with and the need for extra weight.

Best config is a parallel hybrid so that either ice or electric or both can move the car.

Re: hybrid
 

I considered that. I asked this question about 20 years ago, of course with the answer that we have plenty of oil, why change the current powertrain design.

I agree with you on a few points, but also have some rebuttal. It's true that a loco doesn't have a series of gears: some are geared for high-speed, some are for raw power, low-speed, and in-between, etc. But with the absence of a transmission in a vehicle, that's additional weight savings. A parallel engine/motor idea is pretty efficient, but my goal is weight reduction. With Metro's setup, many heavy batteries may be required to store a decent charge to get around. I'm not saying to stick a 0.7L Diesel hooked to a separate generator, but an all-in-one design like a larger household generator -- those little things can power a house. It's only a theory, and I'm sure the current draw would bog it down, but it's an idea. The forklift motor itself looks pretty darn heavy by itself.

RH77

P.S. Say Hi to my In-Laws -- they're staying in Newport and visiting family in Bristol.

small ice
 

Try to find a small high efficiency ICE - that is the problem - the 2.5HP honda motor I have (Yeah I own a honda!) is only rated at 25% efficiency. Been through this with some experts that know electric motor and fuel engines - even thought of converting to propane. The best setup is a small motor and battery to drive the vehicle when moving already and the small and efficient motor to power the car under other driving conditions. Any other combination requires too much weight for the electic parts. Another recent post about an AIR powered hybrid was very interesting - the engineer changed the valve to electric hydralic and could shut off fuel to the cylinders and have them compress and run on air but only because they had complete computer control of the valve timing.

Re: small ice
 

Hey, I made one of those in high school! Yes, I am and was a science nerd. For a competition we ran a small dune-buggy sized vehicle on compressed air. The "transmission" was an impact wrench hooked to a few compressed air tanks and welded to a low-resistance bicycle wheel. After it got going, it really started to take off, until we ran out of air :-( It had to be hydraulic as well, so we pumped our way around with pressurized transmission fluid. We're lucky that nothing blew up. Anyways, off-topic stuff.

Metro- any updates? Kind of excited to see this come together. The motor sounds like a ball-buster, though. Could you raise it up from under the car to it's mounts, using a jack or platform/jack?

RH77

Re: rh77 - good train post. the
 

You know, I do recall seeing that on "MotorWeek" TV. They're also working on vehicles like FedEx delivery trucks. On the GM-Allison test track they had the vehicle stopped, got up to about 10 mph on the electric motor, then the Diesel engine would start, ramp-up, and take-over automatically. We all know that from a standing stop, a huge amount of particulates are belched out of a Diesel truck. That was the focus. The question still remains (maybe I should research this first) but is a CNG bus less pollutive (another word that I probably made up -- I'm sticking with it). At any rate, I'm probably hard on GM because I was forced to buy one as my first car and after 4 senseless failures, I went down the Honda road and never looked back. In Northeastern Ohio, you get bad-mouthed for buying a "foreign" car, with all of the GM and Ford assembly plants around there. And of course we all knew someone who worked for them, so you had to buy one. I was fed up during college when my second Beretta started mixing the oil and coolant due to a blown head gasket. In a heated rage I dumped the Chevy and bought a Barebones Civic DX. The whole family gasped in horror! "Yeah, but it's made in Marysville, Ohio". That was the saving grace. Then when I bought my Evo, my Dad was like, "you know Mitsubishi made planes for the Japanese during World War II" -- mostly razzing me. Some generations just don't give up on International grudges. But for me, GM has rubbed me the wrong way in my generation four times, so I'm bitter. The 4 Honda/Acuras that we've had -- best investment. They've earned my trust.

Anyways, on my Dad's railroad, they shut down the locos at night -- in the Winter they plugged them into a 220V outlet to maintain heat for a slick start. I'm guessing the yard near your house has small "switch" engines, which are hard to start unless plugged-in. Another thing to consider is that they may operate them 24/7 by continuously putting trains together for the open "road", and idle between shifts or during lunchtime. The railroad is a strange employer. Time of day doesn't matter much when you work, and your shift could really vary. If they didn't have a 3rd shift and let them idle all night, that's just, well, not a good idea.

Thanks for the thumbs-up on the post...it's been a while ;-) Honestly I had it coming on some of those as I look back on them.

Anyways, do you know if it's possible to export a vehicle to the 'States? I really wan't an Acura 1.7EL or CSX.

RH77

Quote:Anyways, do you know
 

i know from my own research it's much easier to get one from the U.S. into canada than the other way around.

don't hold me to this, but i think if the model is not available in the US market, you can't import it until it's 25 years old. in canada, the rule is 15 years.

Re: Quote:Anyways, do you know
 

Freakin' Buggah.
Wicked Pissah.
Crapola.
Shoot.

Anyways congrats on your drive motor! And with the cigars, there's no embargo on Cuba up there, so send us some good stuff ;-)

RH77

locos
 

Price of fuel to idle them vs getting them stuck on a track and not start, very cold to be in one when cold, wear and tear on a massive motor like that getting cold and then trying to start it may easily be offset by a few hundred gallons of fuel for the winter.

true, jangeo, but we just
 

true, jangeo, but we just had the warmest winter *on record*, and still these things were idling away... likely out of habit more than necessity, i would say.

fuel used
 

wonder what the rate of fuel use is for an engine that size idling . . .

not sure. it's harder to
 

not sure. it's harder to figure out for a diesel since they don't rely on stoich to run, right?

Re: the second scrap dealer i
 

I'm tearing-up man. That Baker was (sniffle) such an inspiration.

Seriously, great turn-around on the sale of the scrap unit and not getting squashed in the process. What's next?

RH77

One question, what
 

One question, what voltage/current is the EV1 controller rated at?

I'll read through the rest of this topic(and respond with some suggestions) when I get the time. I've been to yuor site many months ago and frequently stop by to see what is written, so I'm sure you know the effect extensive aero mods will have on your range and performance. Make use of them! They are key to 100+ miles range on cheap lead acid batteries.

I'm currently converting my Triumph GT6+ to electric, starting on the cheap(~$2,000, 65 mph top speed, 50 miles range), but will eventually upgrade to make it a high performance car(~$12,000, 140 mph top speed, 0-60 mph in 5.5 seconds, 100 miles range).

I'm looking for cheap parts to source, and have looked in a few places with moderate success.

Re: the baker loot:
 

***edit, double posted

only 68.2???
 

Only 68.2mpg?? - just kidding - warmer weather today I drove 17 miles and got 53.5mpg in the xB. I also got my first door ding from someone in my front left fender above the wheel well.

I posted a new topic on the Geo Suspension / Welding and just signed up for hosting the photos and put a bunch there - check the rust out.