Experiments: Any Requests?

[n0rt0npr0]

how many miles and months do you have on your current ATF?

Do you think I have enough gaslog entries to baseline? If so, I'll change out my ATF to synthetic with you. ...well, I won't flush the old stuff out, I'll keep it simple...just a new filter and 55% fluid changeout.
Think there is merit in doing it that way?

Originally Posted by rh77

First, the current setup: stock intake box and tubing to the throttle body; K&N stock-replacement cone filter. I've experimented with hot air from the exhaust manifold in the Winter and currently, custom PVC piping to the outside air (which isn't working too well for some reason) -- probably not sealed and draws-in air from the engine bay. The inlet is near the wheel well.

I've conducted some tests with intake air temps over the last year or so. Original Thread. Here's what I've determined:

- Each vehicle model handles intake air temperatures differently
- The general exception to the rule: temperatures colder than ~40F require more fuel (multiplier in the ECU)
- There's an ideal range of temperatures for power, and an ideal range for FE (rarely overlap).
- Load vs. IAT can have an effect on FE
- You can fool the sensor (popular on Saturns) but monitoring knock on most models is a concern.

Right now "cooler IATs" mean less than 120F. Getting hotter than 110 starts to rob power and FE. The perfect range, based on daily observations, is humid air at 80-90F. The addition of a wet sponge in the airbox can draw air over it, cool the air, and add humidity. I planned to inject water to dampen the sponge, but it's close-quarters in the box, and the K&N filter tends to loose oil with the extra water.

I'm really leaning towards the Synthetic ATF. I need to dig into the shop manual for the process (haven't done this one yet).

Getting a decent baseline right now is tough. It's hot one day, cooler and rainy the next (and how much EOC-ing is available). I could always just use the 90-day average and go from there

RH77

[rh77]

Originally Posted by n0rt0npr0

how many miles and months do you have on your current ATF?

Do you think I have enough gaslog entries to baseline? If so, I'll change out my ATF to synthetic with you. ...well, I won't flush the old stuff out, I'll keep it simple...just a new filter and 55% fluid changeout.
Think there is merit in doing it that way?

I think it's the original ATF: 10 years and 128K miles. I've been stable at 33-35 mpg lately As far as GasLogs go, I started logging when it was added to site, so every tank since December '05 is in there

I'll need to reference the shop manual to see the procedure. I'm not sure how much of the old stuff I can drain as well. As far as a 55% changeout, it couldn't hurt.

Working in the garage has been a real chore lately -- it's HOT. I spent an hour working on a re-direct for the intake last night (cooler flow). When I got back in the house I was drenched (and this was from 9-10 pm!). The engine was cool too. I guess I'll drink more fluids and dig out the bigger fan from the basement...

RH77

[Bill in Houston]

Originally Posted by rh77

I spent an hour working on a re-direct for the intake last night (cooler flow).

I need to do this too. I think it's toooo hot under the hood... I'll probably just remove the upper grille block, but if I can make a little duct I might try that too.

[bbgobie]

How much a reduction in electrical load effects FE. IE if you cut out 50 watts of power through whatever means, how much does it actually help you? That we you can leave it to each individual to find ways to cut 50watts out, whether through the use of HID's, LED's, no radio, etc.

[brucepick]

I nominate (re-nominate, if you count the Mitsubishi v-g item) testing the Vortekz generators. There's a current thread at http://www.gassavers.org/showthread.php?t=4475

Bruce

[n0rt0npr0]

rick
haha ten years eh? I think you MAY see an abnormal increase in FE when you change your fluid. IIRC tranny pan drops and fluid/filter changes are suposed to done every three years.
Mine is just over three so I am not too long overdue.

And yes your gaslog baseline is set you gassavers oldtimer :P But do you think my monte's is?

All your shop manual's gonna say is: Make sure your tranny fluid is at operating temp - jack car up then put your catch pan under the tranny drain pan - line up your catch pan and remove your "wish my car had one" tranny pan drain plug (u lucky sob)
(I would drop your tranny pan afterward and change the filter and pan gasket(HOWEVER I think you may not even have one?(you need to check that out in your manual)

Anyway then you tighten up the drain plug to 29ft lbs...fill up tranny using your dextron synthetic to the full mark on dipstick...start engine, move thru all gears, stopping back at park...with engine running recheck fluid level on dipstick and add fluid until it reaches 1/8 inch below ADD mark. then go drive around until you think the tranny is back at operating temp and while parked on a level surface with the engine still running the dipstick level should be in the hot range on the dipstick...if not add more.

~Will

Originally Posted by rh77

I think it's the original ATF: 10 years and 128K miles. I've been stable at 33-35 mpg lately As far as GasLogs go, I started logging when it was added to site, so every tank since December '05 is in there

I'll need to reference the shop manual to see the procedure. I'm not sure how much of the old stuff I can drain as well. As far as a 55% changeout, it couldn't hurt.

Working in the garage has been a real chore lately -- it's HOT. I spent an hour working on a re-direct for the intake last night (cooler flow). When I got back in the house I was drenched (and this was from 9-10 pm!). The engine was cool too. I guess I'll drink more fluids and dig out the bigger fan from the basement...

RH77

[omgwtfbyobbq]

I second VGs, I wanna see sum1 w/ a SG take a crack at 'em.

[rh77]

Will-

Hey, good to have you back, btw

Yeah, I have car #7 in the GasLog. I keep hangin' on to it. Oldtimer is right -- I just turned 30 Anyways, my Wife bought the car new and I took over maintenance at 80K miles. According to the records, routine maintenance was done (I did the timing belt / water pump), but no other major maintenance items -- some "upgrades", of course

But yeah, according to the manual, you've got the procedure down. 2.7L is new at change and 5.9L is changed at overhaul -- 54% new. I have no intention (or the talent) to overhaul an automatic transmission, so -- roughly half is good. Turns out, yep -- drain plug. After busting it loose, it should be routine. I don't see a screen or filter in the manual. The rest is adding fluid and running through the different gears to activate the clutches.

As far as the Monte goes, I think you have enough tanks entered for a solid baseline. That 3.1 is a great engine -- I had it in a '95 Beretta Level II. The torque and low RPM cruise really contributes to some decent FE numbers. The last gen. Buick Century 3.1L really hit the mark for full-size V-6 FE.

First, I need to find out where to recycle the fluid, then find the time . I'm still getting 140F IATs, so something else needs to happen first with the intake.

-Rick

Originally Posted by n0rt0npr0

rick
haha ten years eh? I think you MAY see an abnormal increase in FE when you change your fluid. IIRC tranny pan drops and fluid/filter changes are suposed to done every three years.
Mine is just over three so I am not too long overdue.

And yes your gaslog baseline is set you gassavers oldtimer :P But do you think my monte's is?

All your shop manual's gonna say is: Make sure your tranny fluid is at operating temp - jack car up then put your catch pan under the tranny drain pan - line up your catch pan and remove your "wish my car had one" tranny pan drain plug (u lucky sob)
(I would drop your tranny pan afterward and change the filter and pan gasket(HOWEVER I think you may not even have one?(you need to check that out in your manual)

Anyway then you tighten up the drain plug to 29ft lbs...fill up tranny using your dextron synthetic to the full mark on dipstick...start engine, move thru all gears, stopping back at park...with engine running recheck fluid level on dipstick and add fluid until it reaches 1/8 inch below ADD mark. then go drive around until you think the tranny is back at operating temp and while parked on a level surface with the engine still running the dipstick level should be in the hot range on the dipstick...if not add more.

~Will

[Hockey4mnhs]

i like the tranny idea alot go for that one!

[n0rt0npr0]

Rick,

Every one of the transmission shops near me love to take my tranny fluid. Motor Oil too. So, I'm sure if you just map which shop is nearest to you and then call them on good measure to ask, they'll say come on down.

Have you thought about which brand synthetic to try? And is there any merit in having me try some different brand than you, or maybe its better if we use the same exact stuff?