Synthetic Bad for the TSX

[Gary Palmer]

rh77: What you have described does not make much sense. I would heartily agree on taking your remnants to the dealer. Something is not right, if your getting that much material. If it was plastigauge, it wouldn't be enough for you to even notice, like a fingerprint size of plastic slivers. Something else is going on and it isn't good.

[lindermant]

rh77,

Not sure if you frequent BITOG (oil related forum), but you might want to check out their board (http://theoildrop.server101.com/forums/ubbthreads.php) specifically the "gas engine used oil analysis" section to see if anyone else has experienced what you have with their TSX.

I'd have the oil/and or the filter looked at by someone like Terry Dyson (http://www.dysonanalysis.com/) - and armed with his independant report I'd head to the dealer to see what they could do for me...

I had some funny stuff in my break-in oil on my civic, and I suspect it was blue paint (internal engine components most likely inspeciton marked during assembly), but no hard stuff:
http://theoildrop.server101.com/foru...rue#Post250699
http://theoildrop.server101.com/foru...e=0#Post732290
http://theoildrop.server101.com/foru...rue#Post346672

the trick with cutting open the filter to see what may/may not be inside is to not use a hacksaw, but rather a pipe cutting tool or old style can opener (hack saw will leave lotsa metal shavings - don't want to confuse them if they get into the filter can while cutting it open).

[rh77]

This is more serious than I may have thought. Here is a picture (it's very solid and gritty, and looks like it has polyester "hairs" coming off of it).



I'll be phoning the dealer when they open in about 15-minutes...

Thanks...

RH77

Originally Posted by lindermant

rh77,

Not sure if you frequent BITOG (oil related forum), but you might want to check out their board (http://theoildrop.server101.com/forums/ubbthreads.php) specifically the "gas engine used oil analysis" section to see if anyone else has experienced what you have with their TSX.

I'd have the oil/and or the filter looked at by someone like Terry Dyson (http://www.dysonanalysis.com/) - and armed with his independant report I'd head to the dealer to see what they could do for me...

I had some funny stuff in my break-in oil on my civic, and I suspect it was blue paint (internal engine components most likely inspeciton marked during assembly), but no hard stuff:
http://theoildrop.server101.com/foru...rue#Post250699
http://theoildrop.server101.com/foru...e=0#Post732290
http://theoildrop.server101.com/foru...rue#Post346672

the trick with cutting open the filter to see what may/may not be inside is to not use a hacksaw, but rather a pipe cutting tool or old style can opener (hack saw will leave lotsa metal shavings - don't want to confuse them if they get into the filter can while cutting it open).

[Silveredwings]

Originally Posted by rh77

This is more serious than I may have thought. Here is a picture (it's very solid and gritty, and looks like it has polyester "hairs" coming off of it).
RH77

If that's glass-impregnated plastic, it could be abrasive. What internal parts would be made out of that? Anyone?

[Spule 4]

Originally Posted by rh77

This is more serious than I may have thought. Here is a picture (it's very solid and gritty, and looks like it has polyester "hairs" coming off of it).



I'll be phoning the dealer when they open in about 15-minutes...

Thanks...

RH77

YUCK, no idea what that is....and I own four cats, so I am used to stuff like this!

(edit) PLEASE do let us know wat you find out, and best of luck.

[JanGeo]

eewww that stuff looks nasty - it may be some gasket material or part of something that was in the oil filter that got loose. Definately not something that should be in the oil for sure.

[rh77]

I have 2 cats, and I have no idea what it is either! I'll keep everyone posted as we go...

I should find out what the deal is later this week, as they said they'd get to it Monday sometime.

A second problem I'm having them look over is the starter. Since we bought it, the starter has acted funny. Every 3 weeks or so (very random event) you turn the key to start it, and the starter just spins freely. Then key-off, try it again, and it engages to start the car -- another

You save up for a $#%&-ing new car, and @#$$%#!@#@#!!!!!

RH77

[SVOboy]

*hug* for you Rick, I'm sure it'll work itself out.

[rh77]

Originally Posted by theclencher

I've had my one and only new vehicle for this lifetime. Everyone who buys new and floods the market with cheap used cars has my sincere appreciation!

You're welcome -- and you can thank my wife....

Anyways, *hand-shake with the combination one-armed hug* back to you -- in congratulation on your keeping the temptation of this site away from your studies, Ben, and thanks for the understanding on the mechanical issues. It looks like things are going well there (?). Meanwhile, the Integra keeps running like a champ.

If that gunk got in the crankcase, I'm sure the feeder tubes that lube the valvetrain are all clogged, etc. My concern is that the whole engine will require a tear-down if they decide it's serious -- and that's never good (unless I can convince them to import the 2.2L Diesel as a replacement ). At least they offered a loaner car when I got back into town. I'll be hounding them daily...

[Ted Hart]

Originally Posted by rh77

A week or so ago, I changed the oil in the TSX from the Break-In oil to a fully synthetic variety. The owners' manual stated that the weight must be identical to that of the "dino-oil" variety, and so, in went 5W-30.

Since then, FE has decreased, and the car does not pull hills with the same efficiency as before (as noted by the FE meter on the dash and the cumulative avg. at the end of the tank). This has been separately confirmed by my wife,

"The car doesn't have the pep it did before the oil change".

She tries to hypermile using the feedback meter as well.

I spoke to another Honda owner today who had a similar experience in an 04 CR-V, and with the replacement of Dino-Oil, FE and power increased back to normal levels.

Now, what in the H-E Double Hockey Sticks is going on here??? Should the blend have gone down to 0W-30 -- then if so, the warranty may be voided for failure to follow the manufacturers specs.

Inquiry 1: Any idea why this would happen?
*
Inquiry 2: When I changed the Break-In oil, there were all kinds of heavy-guage plastic shavings in the old oil -- is this normal for change #1?
*
Inquiry 3: FE is down by at least 2-3 mpg -- how soon should I ditch this stuff and put regular oil back in? It was expensive but if it helps FE -- I'm crazy enough to do it.

THX

RH77

Hi, H-E-Double hockey sticks! I love this name!
About your oil change "chips"...it is NOT normal! There should be nothing of this magnatude in your oil! I suggest you get this (new?) car back to the dealer from whence you got it! It sounds like your timing chain tensioner is coming apart! And... your engine has pumped that mess through your oil pump, clogged up the galleries in the block / crankshaft / and rocker arms / shafts! Based on what you find (the source), I would start screaming "Warranty"! This is not normal!
About "break-in"oil... the engine is lapping in all sliding / rubbing surfaces when new. After the first 500 miles, I change it & the filter. Lots of metallic "fuzz" comes out! You don't want this in your engine! Replace with whatever kind of (new! not reclaimed!) oil and a new filter.Change both again at 3 K miles...every 3 K miles thereafter.
Synthetic oil...what is it? "Synthetic" sounds so neato! Actually, advertising hype being what it is ... I started digging in the literature. It turns out ... synthetic oils are really dino (petroleum) oils with their molecules 'sized' to be all the same . That's it...no more, no less! This is the "synthetic' part! Gads! been flim-flammed, again! The price? have you noticed? Yikes!
So...get thee back to the dealership! Prepare yourself to receive a bunch of flack! Don't swallow this for a minute! Last resort? Call / contact the factory! Tell the dealer this, too. Don't take no crap!
You have bought (IMHO) a piece of "bean counter" plastic crap...to increase profit margin! Let us know how this turns out! -Ted Hart