Burn Rate Modifier

[spotaneagle]

magua= salesman ?

[magua]

ugh. no. i'm too blunt to be a salesman.

[GasSavers_BIBI]

to blunt that u need 5.7 liters to move ur around

[magua]

so syntek claims that by lowering the temperature that fuel needs to reach in order to reach combustion, more fuel will combust and will have a longer burn rate - thereby increasing the amount of fuel you actually use and reducing the amount of unused fuel that goes out the exhaust. Does that ACTUALLY make sense?

it sounds good, but what temperature does the fuel usually reach anyway? is their claim plausible? any technical gurus out there??? I guess i'm just having second doubts. i know what i think i saw as improvement. but i've been googling syntec and "xft" all weekend. can't find anything on it that isn't printed by the company or apparent distributors.

[spotaneagle]

if you replaced all the words reffering to the fuel additive you're talking about with water injection, it would almost work

[JanGeo]

If you are getting 85mpg in your F650GS that is amazing - I have an italian Moto Morini 350 V twin and only got about 80mpg with that back in 1986 when gas didn't have ethanol in it. I did get 60mpg on my 1978 R100s after some major tranny and rear end work and leaning out the carbs and that was also a long time ago before E10 gasoline. Getting fuel to burn better is the number one problem with gasoline these days and anything that helps that will yield some big MPG gains.

[Fuel Miser]

Originally Posted by JanGeo

I have an italian Moto Morini 350

Have you seen the latest (March, you know how it goes) Cycle World?
Oh, you're gonna love it.

[theholycow]

Originally Posted by magua

so syntek claims that by lowering the temperature that fuel needs to reach in order to reach combustion

That sounds similar to, but not exactly the same as, lowering the octane rating of the fuel. I think it would have the same effect, which would be detrimental to fuel economy.

Maybe someone who understands the issue better than I do can confirm or deny that interpretation and explain better.

[bobc455]

Originally Posted by theholycow

That sounds similar to, but not exactly the same as, lowering the octane rating of the fuel.

That's kinda how I'm seeing it. Kinda.

A lower octane-rated fuel will be less volatile, meaning it won't initiate combustion until a higher temperature (or pressure, but we'll assume that's constant). So I would have said it sounds more like a high-octane fuel.

However, if this miracle-juice also slows the burn rate (i.e. modifies combustion as to slow it down), then it sounds like the goal is to "save" some more of the combustion pressure until the piston is further down in the bore.

Think of a completely stationary engine with the piston at TDC- if a mixture in the cylinder now explodes, the engine (theoretically) won't rotate but you'll pound the connecting rod bearings awfully hard. On the other hand, if you picture the stationary engine at about 75 degrees past TDC (or 90 degrees, if that makes it easier for you), you'll have almost perfect transmission of combustion pressure to rotational force on the crankshaft (and that rotational force is what we're all after).

So, if this miracle juice can make peak combustion pressure occur later in the combustion cycle, such that peak pressure will occur closer to the 75-degree point after TDC, it might just improve overall efficiency.

However, since this stuff is dampening the burn rate, I would think that 1) the spark would have to be much earlier in the cycle (probably 10 - 20 degrees, and not many people have that much control over their ignition), and 2) the combustion process would slow such that combustion is probably still occurring when you open the exhaust valve (hence bleeding off more unburnt HCs and cylinder pressure in general) (even more than already occurs in a standard engine already). But if enough advance can be put in the ignition, maybe that will be enough to overcome the exhaust-valve losses.

So if the mixture lowers the initiation temperature AND dampens the burn rate, AND you have enough control over your timing to take advantage of it, there MIGHT be some merit to this product.

But I'm still wicked skeptical.

-BC

[trollbait]

A lower octane-rated fuel will be less volatile, meaning it won't initiate combustion until a higher temperature (or pressure, but we'll assume that's constant). So I would have said it sounds more like a high-octane fuel.

Shouldn't this be the other way around? High compression engines are the ones that require high octane fuel, and will knock on low octane fuel because that fuel is more likely to preignite under the higher pressure.