Transparency in the Top 10.

[Maillemann]

I'm somewhat irregular in my forum activity here, so if this has been bandied about before, forgive me, but I feel the need to voice my concern.

Firstly, there seems to be the persistent issue of motorcycles and scooters ending up in the "gasoline" category. That's an issue I know has come up before, and while I find it annoying, it's not my main concern here.

Now and then I have noticed at least a few vehicles in the top 10 whose most recent tank(s) - or even their only(!) tank - covers a very few number of miles and is wholly unrepresentative of what most would consider a measurable "real-world" MPG figure.

Would it make sense to require a minimum total distance traveled before allowing entries to be counted towards the Top 10? Time and again we hear it told or tell others not to be so certain over changes - good or bad - in their MPG until they've seen a few tanks and accounted for all the variables. Why then allow singular and/or low-mileage entires to be representative of a vehicles true MPG performance?

[cems70]

I agree completely and would like to see a minimum distance traveled to qualify for the Top 10. I would also like to see motorcycles and scooters excluded. No offense to those who achieve great FE in these, but they just don't belong in the Top 10.

[101mpg]

I'd make this my personal crusade if I could get permissions to do so appropriately as a moderator. I've been bringing this up with the mods but as yet do not have tools or a specific person assigned to clean this up.

As one who is in the top 10 as far as % above EPA, this is something important to me. I've been analyzing my driving habits including a whole lot of EOI and neutral coasting which I'm trying to work into a thread for others who are interested in my personal methods. I know I have learned a lot from others' techniques.

Scooters and motorcycles and hybrids have categories, and these vehicles should not be in the gasoline section.

Rest assured you're being heard, even if we can't fix it as of yet.

[101mpg]

What minimum distance would you suggest, btw? I'd like to hear thoughts on this.

[cems70]

Originally Posted by 101mpg

What minimum distance would you suggest, btw? I'd like to hear thoughts on this.

I believe 12k or 15k is the annual car lease allowance and also the basis for many car manufactuer warranties (used to be anyway). Even AAA states that the average American drives 12,000 - 15,000 miles per year. So perhaps this or something close to it should be the minimum distance. At the same time, I don't think it's fair to exclude those who don't drive as much due to where they live (city or close to work), or due to personal choices (using bicycle or mass transportation). But there should be a substantial minimum distance to weed out those who only drive a few thousand miles per year.

[Maillemann]

Originally Posted by 101mpg

What minimum distance would you suggest, btw? I'd like to hear thoughts on this.

I had originally thought of something around a few thousand miles. I think that a year's worth of driving - while providing meaningful data - might rapidly dampen the spirits of many driven (haha) by the thrill of competition who want to get in on the game within a reasonable time-frame.

Since we list a 90-day running average why not figure on some mileage based on this? In the 3k range? For even the longest-ranged vehicles this would represent at least three tanks.

Otherwise, perhaps adopt the standard for some MPG record-setting requirement (Guinness Records or the like)? The EPA test cycle would be too short but maybe some other agency has an equivalent which could be appropriated.

[thornburg]

Originally Posted by 101mpg

What minimum distance would you suggest, btw? I'd like to hear thoughts on this.

Bumping this thread as I feel a bit like this is an issue too, and I'm nowhere near top 10.

IMO, a very simple and easy limit would make it much more fair without being very discouraging.

I would say that in order to be entered the person should need to have entered:

At minimum and in total (i.e. all entries added together must be this much or more):

400 miles and
4 gaslog entries and
20 gallons of fuel used

within the last 90 days.

For those concerned about ruling out people who drive very little or have extremely high MPG vehicles, 400 mi in 90 days is 1600 mi/year, and at 100MPG it would still only require 8000 mi/year to make 20 gallons in 90 days. That could be a little harsh on motorcycles/trikes, so maybe they could have a 10 or 12 gallon requirement? Or maybe there could be a 16 gallon overall requirement, if it would be too difficult to make separate requirements for different categories.

[palemelanesian]

Originally Posted by thornburg

I would say that in order to be entered the person should need to have entered:

At minimum and in total (i.e. all entries added together must be this much or more):

400 miles and
4 gaslog entries and
20 gallons of fuel used

within the last 90 days.

That one might knock me out. I stretch my fills as far as possible. Some 3-month periods I only have 3 fills.

[Jay2TheRescue]

Originally Posted by 101mpg

I'd make this my personal crusade if I could get permissions to do so appropriately as a moderator. I've been bringing this up with the mods but as yet do not have tools or a specific person assigned to clean this up.

As one who is in the top 10 as far as % above EPA, this is something important to me. I've been analyzing my driving habits including a whole lot of EOI and neutral coasting which I'm trying to work into a thread for others who are interested in my personal methods. I know I have learned a lot from others' techniques.

Scooters and motorcycles and hybrids have categories, and these vehicles should not be in the gasoline section.

Rest assured you're being heard, even if we can't fix it as of yet.

I don't know if that ranking page is run through vBulletin or not, but on vBulletin there are 2 classes of moderators. Moderators, and Super Moderators. I know that Super Mods have more powers than Mods, but I'm not exactly sure what is extra. I'm a mod on another vBulleitn forum, but they don't use the Moderator function. All mods on that site are Super Moderators. If the ranking page is run through vBulletin and you are a SuperMod I think you should be able to move a vehicle to another category, just as if you moved a thread to another category because someone posted it in the wrong area. Then again that function may only be available to those with vBulletin "Contractor" or "Administrator" status. It all depends on how the site was initially setup.

-Jay

[bowtieguy]

what about a minimum fillup? i see some that log quick fills of 2 or 3 gallons, presumably of a fantastic trip. this would make one's average inflated no?

for cars, a minimum of 8 US gal for example, might be warranted.