Not everyone wants a large diesel engine

[Dieselmech2]

Originally Posted by itripper

29 MPG 1/2 ton Dodge truck now! light duty diesel, I am impressed, the gas mileage is super high for a full size pickup. Ram EcoDiesel - Fuel Economy, Power & Efficiency - Ram Trucks and 9200 lbs towing, CRAZY! I admit I was wrong about small engines in trucks, this new Dodge seems amazing.

Don't get too excited, the 1/2ton dodge gets good milage when driving around empty but don't fall for the "tows great" or "will tow 9000lb's" cause that's plain bs. The truck is too big/heavy/too many options to drive/haul in traffic here with that little power. Like I said, a buddy traded his 6 month old 1/2 ton dodge in on a 3/4ton just so he could get the bigger cummins. He loved the cruising around milage but really, it's a big car with an open trunk. He almost bought an ecoboost f-150 like my others friends after hearing their towing stories but wanted diesel and the ford dealership wouldn't give him as much for a trade in as the dodge dealership would. So he bought a diesel that will pull, from the dodge dealership. Check out the payload..then figure in 4 people at say 200lb's each...then any other crap you have laying around in a truck, say a total of 1000lb's..what's the payload again?....1800lb's or something like that....uh that leaves 800lb's you can put in the back??? Yeah, that's a car with an open trunk.

Don't get me wrong, I applaud dodge for building a smaller diesel and sticking it in a 1/2ton, that's awesome. But when a trucks "raison d'etre" is hauling stuff and that's exactly where this truck falls short..that's a fail in my book.

[Draigflag]

You guys need the epic 500 to 550 bhp diesels from VW/AUDI or Mercedes, must be great for towing, they seem too large and powerful just for an SUV and would suit a truck better imo.

[Draigflag]

Originally Posted by trollbait

They just started selling them last year or so.
Ford is also selling their Euro work van, the Transit, here too.

Transit is a British icon, probably the most popular van in Britain. There's not a day goes by anywhere when you don't see one, pretty much dominates the commercial industry here. Good to see you guys get some cool euro stuff now, although some have been ruined by silly automatic gearboxes again grrrrrr...

[Dieselmech2]

There is no question there are good options or engineering went into the transit and transit connect. However...the looks...well, they're not "pretty" vehicles but at least they're not as hidious as the dodges. Holy crap the smash nosed dodge is beyond ugly, beyond hidious!
The doors on the transit that open so much more than the econoline are great, etc,etc...but looks are really subjective and I haven't heard a single person say "hey that's a cute new van" or "wow, that's some nice styling".
Euro vans are narrow and tall, awesome for the narrow tiny roads and access points in europe, but man are they tippy when you're doing 110km's and meet a tractor trailer doing 120km's! The tiny diametre tires and tight suspension are the only things keeping them flat on the road, they blow around 100X as much as an econoline. But, that's the future so that's what we get....wouldn't call it cool euro stuff though. The focus with the revo-knuckle front end and 300hp? Now THAT'S cool euro stuff. A smash nosed, tippy van? Not so much.
Load up a transit and drive 10-12hr's for a road trip and see if the "firm seats that support so well" feel as good as the plush "overstuffed chair" type seats in the econoline. Different driving habits/roads/comfort expectations/etc.

I wanted to buy a transit connect diesel for a second vehicle but the wife said it was too ugly so we bought a fully loaded Edge. Different animal altogether but it's what made the wife happy. (and you can't get a diesel transit connect here, grrr)

[Draigflag]

Yea it's function over form, no van is designed to be pretty! Although I think the Transit ST looks cool with its big alloys, huge Viper stripes and body coloured bodykit, but it's not everyones cup of tea. My brother drives a medium wheel Base Merc sprinter which has cross wind adaption, works similar to esp, it brakes different wheels to keep the van steady in big crosswinds, works well. The seats are firm due to the geography of Europe, most of the roads here dip dive and bend like a racetrack so in a top heavy van, you need to be kept straight to remain in control. You'd be surprised how fast vans can be unladen!

[itripper]

Originally Posted by Dieselmech2

Don't get too excited, the 1/2ton dodge gets good milage when driving around empty but don't fall for the "tows great" or "will tow 9000lb's" cause that's plain bs. The truck is too big/heavy/too many options to drive/haul in traffic here with that little power. Like I said, a buddy traded his 6 month old 1/2 ton dodge in on a 3/4ton just so he could get the bigger cummins. He loved the cruising around milage but really, it's a big car with an open trunk. He almost bought an ecoboost f-150 like my others friends after hearing their towing stories but wanted diesel and the ford dealership wouldn't give him as much for a trade in as the dodge dealership would. So he bought a diesel that will pull, from the dodge dealership. Check out the payload..then figure in 4 people at say 200lb's each...then any other crap you have laying around in a truck, say a total of 1000lb's..what's the payload again?....1800lb's or something like that....uh that leaves 800lb's you can put in the back??? Yeah, that's a car with an open trunk.

Don't get me wrong, I applaud dodge for building a smaller diesel and sticking it in a 1/2ton, that's awesome. But when a trucks "raison d'etre" is hauling stuff and that's exactly where this truck falls short..that's a fail in my book.

Well I am VERY excited about the new Dodge diesel and the ECOboost Ford, they have exactly what is needed for a drivetrain in the 1/2 ton truck series. If you want to actually haul or tow heavy items it is common knowledge that you need a 3/4 or 1 ton truck, you do not buy a 1/2 ton truck for anything serious. I have a large Chevy diesel 4x4 5th wheel hauler that I love, but my driver for hauling my bikes, off road camping and other stuff is an older 1/2 ton Z71 Chevy Silverado with a 5.3 that gets 15 mpg. EVERYTHING I use that truck for could be done by the ECOBoost or the Dodge diesel with double the MPG. Where I live here in Tucson every third family car is a 4 dr 1/2 ton truck, people like the visibility and versatility of them. To get 29 mpg out of a truck makes them very viable to use as a daily driver. I personally am very jealous of those new trucks but I am not going to spend the money for a new one. I also have a very old 65 Dodge 225 CID (3.5 liter?) truck that is 1/2 ton, it only gets 14 mpg and has maybe 150 horsepower. At least in the state of Arizona, 90% of the trucks here are 1/2 ton grocery getters that get parked in garages and rarely used for hauling, that is the demographic these new fuel efficient trucks are after.

LARGE

[litesong]

In 2013 I was interested in a Chevy manual EcoCruze, but couldn't get it for less than $20000. Got a 2013 auto Elantra for $15,500.

In June 2015 I was interested in a Chevy diesel Cruze, but couldn't get it for less than $24,000. Got a 2016 manual Elantra for $12,800.

With the VW diesel pollution scandal & other diesels suspect, I'm glad the EcoCruze, diesel Cruze & the VW diesel were over-priced. Oh, yeah....my auto & manual Elantras get 43-46+ mpg on the road. Must a bin all them leadfooters complainin' 'bout the Elantra mpg.

[gregsfc]

No bigger fan than me of diesel-engine technologies for light-duty pickup trucks, as I've wanted and needed a pickup for a few years but have been holding out for a small diesel. I already knew that once they finally arrived in the market they'd be thousands more due to strict emissions laws in U.S., and I understand the cost dilemma faced by OEMs in offering them to Americans, but still hoped for a 4 cylinder in a mid-size or 1/2-ton with a six cylinder and pay maybe four or five thousand more than a base model. I'm that much of a diesel fan.

They finally came with an Ecodiesel in the Ram and Duramax in the Colorado/Canyon. I gave up and got the lightest and smallest Ecoboost I could get in the F150 Reg cab, 2wd, short bed and 3.31 reg rear axle. So far can achieve 21+ in mixed and conservative driving. I think I could do much, much better mpg wise with Colorado/Canyon Duramax, but herein lies the problem. Not only do the manufacturers ask for a $4K-$5K premium, they offer them only in larger configurations and only in highly featured trucks, so what you end up with is the possibility to buy an F150 and get over 20 mpg with a 2.7 Ecoboost in a 4167 pound 1/2-ton truck for around $27K, or choose a more-truck-than-I-need Ram Ecodiesel for over $38K and 26 mpg, or more-cab-than-I-need-and-more towing-features-than-I-need Colorado/Canyon Duramax for over $34K and 28-29 mpg.

This strict, unnecessary NOx limit placed on diesel autos in the U.S. keep us from getting great diesel deals and vehicles at reasonable prices, so now I'm stuck with a pretty good gas guzzler.

And please everyone...quit calling Ram trucks "Dodge". Ram has been separated from the Dodge badge now for a few years and there has never been a Dodge Ram 1500 truck with a diesel engine. It's a Ram and only a Ram.

[gregsfc]

Originally Posted by Dieselmech2

Don't get too excited, the 1/2ton dodge gets good milage when driving around empty but don't fall for the "tows great" or "will tow 9000lb's" cause that's plain bs. The truck is too big/heavy/too many options to drive/haul in traffic here with that little power. Like I said, a buddy traded his 6 month old 1/2 ton dodge in on a 3/4ton just so he could get the bigger cummins. He loved the cruising around milage but really, it's a big car with an open trunk. He almost bought an ecoboost f-150 like my others friends after hearing their towing stories but wanted diesel and the ford dealership wouldn't give him as much for a trade in as the dodge dealership would. So he bought a diesel that will pull, from the dodge dealership. Check out the payload..then figure in 4 people at say 200lb's each...then any other crap you have laying around in a truck, say a total of 1000lb's..what's the payload again?....1800lb's or something like that....uh that leaves 800lb's you can put in the back??? Yeah, that's a car with an open trunk.

Don't get me wrong, I applaud dodge for building a smaller diesel and sticking it in a 1/2ton, that's awesome. But when a trucks "raison d'etre" is hauling stuff and that's exactly where this truck falls short..that's a fail in my book.

But how much hauling/towing capacity do most people really want and need when considering a 1/2-ton truck? And why is it now that everyone wants and expects half-tons to tow 9000 lbs? I know 1/2-tons are about work but it should be about 1/2-ton work and lets move away from all this craziness, and the OEMs should quit making these outlandish claims. I know all the OEMs are tauting these huge towing numbers, but really, does anyone really need or want to tow 9000 lbs with only a 1/2-ton truck no matter the engine? I do find fault in Ram for not using this reasonable 1/2-ton diesel engine in reasonable configurations where the 240 horsepower and a 3.0 Ecodiesel could really shine. You know like in the reg cab 2wd work trucks doing 1/2-ton work.

[Draigflag]

Do you guys get the new Mitsubishi L200 there? A really nice looking truck, it's won every award going over here including best off road performance, best towing capacity, best maneuverability, best economy, lowest emissions for its class etc etc. It can tow about 8000 lbs, but like I said, for its size that's best in class. In the road tests I've read it gets between 35 and 40 UK MPG, maybe closer to 50 on the highway which is incredible for a big truck.