Clearing Up Synthetic Oil Confussion

[bowtieguy]

i ran across some info that defines the nature of true synthetics vs "advertised" synthetics. in short, non-POA based synthetics are actually conventional oils given a synthetic process. here's an explanation...http://www.lubeassist.com.au/?page_id=67

as usual, opinions vary, but here's a long discussion about what is what, in regard to quality of POA and hydrocracked synthetics...http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums...=950368&page=2

what did i learn? the bottom line...nothing(besides how each are derived). it seems that hyrocracked(fake synthetic) is better than conventional, and POA is better than hydrocracked. this is what i suspected all along. it's interesting tho. so, i'll keep on using my brand of POA based synthetic and simply change it annually--nice, simple, economical, and time wise! oh, and better for the environment!

[imzjustplayin]

Uh... As nice as it is that you've discovered that most synthetic oils aren't PAOs or have them, what you don't know is that the performance of todays "synthetics" (tier 3+ oils) is quite good and is pretty close to that of PAOs. Back in the 70s when synthetics first came out, companies like Amsoil were using PAOs. But then in the 90s, they found out they could make highly refined oils that had similar properties to that of PAOs, making them superior to conventional oils. Today though, the "synthetic" oils from like quakerstate or Mobil are very close in performance to the original PAOs that were used in the first synthetic oils..

The main benefit to using the fake synthetics over the true synthetics, especially the "fake" synthetics you can get today is that you can get very very similar performance at a fraction of the cost..

The "synthetics" are very very good today so I wouldn't lose sleep over the fact that they don't use PAOs like the true synthetics do.. In racing applications, despite the close performance of non PAOs and PAOs, they still use PAOs because they have a bit better performance, though at a much much higher cost.

[bowtieguy]

maybe one of us is missing something...true, 3/4 of the price is a fraction, but i'll pay the extra 1/4 to get the best. if you read my links fully, you'll find that the non-POA synthetics have also had sludge issues(like conventional), tho at higher mileage intervals(changes).

i've not heard any issues of the sort w/ true synthetics. one fact remains: POA based oils are the only ones used in jet engines. auto engines don't come close in rpm, heat, nor friction, but hey, for a couple bucks more per qt...that's cheap insurance.

it really surprises me the disinterest of some in regard to synthetics, especially here at GS. they really can save time and money, as well as be a great conservation tool. oh well...

[theholycow]

I'm going to ask the same question here that I ask in every thread where someone is seeking oil nirvana:
How many engine failures have you experienced that could have been prevented by using better oil?

[imzjustplayin]

I now recommend "synthetic" oil, in fact if you get any of the oils with a 0W rating like 0W-20, it's guaranteed to be "synthetic". "Synthetic" oil is also really good for turbo charged vehicles like my sister's Volvo. But I can't recommend the PAO oils (true synthetics) because they're usually significantly more expensive and unnecessary in our application.

Originally Posted by theholycow

I'm going to ask the same question here that I ask in every thread where someone is seeking oil nirvana:
How many engine failures have you experienced that could have been prevented by using better oil?

Well, is it better oil or better oil service interval?
Cause pretty much all the corollas that burn oil get sticky piston rings and to prevent that from happening, I'd imagine changing the oil religiously or using a better oil would've prevented the problems they so commonly experience. Great oil 5-8K miles, crappy oil at 3-4K miles. I think it's pretty rare to find a non oil burning Corolla made between '93-'06.

[pgfpro]

Originally Posted by *************

I now recommend "synthetic" oil, in fact if you get any of the oils with a 0W rating like 0W-20, it's guaranteed to be "synthetic". "Synthetic" oil is also really good for turbo charged vehicles like my sister's Volvo. But I can't recommend the PAO oils (true synthetics) because they're usually significantly more expensive and unnecessary in our application.



Well, is it better oil or better oil service interval?
Cause pretty much all the corollas that burn oil get sticky piston rings and to prevent that from happening, I'd imagine changing the oil religiously or using a better oil would've prevented the problems they so commonly experience. Great oil 5-8K miles, crappy oil at 3-4K miles. I think it's pretty rare to find a non oil burning Corolla made between '93-'06.

My wife has a 95' Corolla and it doesn't use a drop of oil. Over 200K on it.

We change the oil around every 4k and run what ever Dino oil is on sale.

I run regular Valvoline in all my turbo cars and have never had a problem. On the turbo cars I change them out every 2K to 4K depending on how much they were raced.

[Erdrick]

Originally Posted by *************

I now recommend "synthetic" oil, in fact if you get any of the oils with a 0W rating like 0W-20, it's guaranteed to be "synthetic". "Synthetic" oil is also really good for turbo charged vehicles like my sister's Volvo. But I can't recommend the PAO oils (true synthetics) because they're usually significantly more expensive and unnecessary in our application.



Well, is it better oil or better oil service interval?
Cause pretty much all the corollas that burn oil get sticky piston rings and to prevent that from happening, I'd imagine changing the oil religiously or using a better oil would've prevented the problems they so commonly experience. Great oil 5-8K miles, crappy oil at 3-4K miles. I think it's pretty rare to find a non oil burning Corolla made between '93-'06.

I guess I must be lucky -- I personally own two of them. An 03 and 04, and even with 10k OCI (w/Mobil 1 0W-30, Toyota oil filter) not a drop burned.

[imzjustplayin]

Originally Posted by Erdrick

I guess I must be lucky -- I personally own two of them. An 03 and 04, and even with 10k OCI (w/Mobil 1 0W-30, Toyota oil filter) not a drop burned.

OCI? These Corollas tend to start their oil burning after like 40K miles..

[Ford Man]

Originally Posted by *************

OCI? These Corollas tend to start their oil burning after like 40K miles..

OCI=Oil change interval.

[imzjustplayin]

Originally Posted by Ford Man

OCI=Oil change interval.

Well I'd imagine 10K miles of light highway driving would be ok but for the most part, people end up doing 7K miles of mixed city and highway driving with the occasional small trip on a cold day which is about as bad as it gets.